Tanya says:June 19, 2013 4:45 AM
Hi Admin,
I’ve got my self in a confusing situation. I’m an Ahmadi (see below) girl, 24 years old, living in Pakistan. Not sure if you’re familiar with the Ahmadi sect, but in Pakistan we are not considered Muslims, although Ahmadis believe that only their version of Islam is the true Islam and when it comes to marriage, we are ONLY allowed to marry within the Ahmadi Community. Even marriage to other mainstream Muslims is not permissible and if a girl is to marry outside the community, then even her parents are kicked out of the community and the other members of this faith are supposed to boycott them socially. So if I choose to marry outside the community, even my parents will have to face the consequences.
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Admin says:
Dear Tanya,
We feel your pain. You are an innocent victim of this society. You are trapped into a silo created by religious leaders for their benefits.
We understand if you don’t have strength to fight against the society or go against religious leaders. For this reason, easiest solution could be if you could find and marry a well-educated and decent Ahmadi guy. However, if you cannot find a good match in your own community, then consider your other options.
For a year, can you please focus on your education? After that, get a decent paying job and that will help you take decisions for your life that are right for you. Later, plan to find a job/education out of Pakistan. Without good education and financial independence, you will be at mercy of others.
That Christian guy is 3 years younger than you; will that be an issue in your community and surroundings? Is he well educated? Is he really a decent guy?
Now lets talk of the most critical issue, the interfaith marriage. You said, “I am in good terms with his family and relatives”. What does that mean? Are they willing to accept you as a Muslim and he is willing to marry you without converting you to Christianity? How will you get married, by Nikaah or a Church wedding or both weddings? Which Imam and/or Christian Priest are ready to perform your dual marriages? What will be the names of your children, Muslim or Christian? Will your children have Baptism to announce them Christians or will they be Muslims in a Christian home? What will you teach your children… is Jesus an apostle or “son” of Allah? If you want to learn of truth, just tell his parents that your children will never be baptized, is that okay? Let us know what they have to say. Lets discuss more later. -Admin
More from Tanya: June 20, 2013
More from Tanya: June 22, 2013
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Ahmadiyya is an Islamic reformist movement founded in British India near the end of the 19th century. It originated with the life and teachings of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (1835–1908), who claimed to have fulfilled the prophecies of the world’s reformer during the end times, who was to herald the Eschaton or day of judgement as predicted in the traditions of various world religions and bring about the final triumph of Islam as per Islamic prophecy. He claimed that he was the Mujaddid (divine reformer) of the 14th Islamic century, the promised Messiah and Mahdi awaited by Muslims. The adherents of the Ahmadiyya movement are referred to as Ahmadis or Ahmadi Muslims.
Ahmadi thought emphasizes the belief that Islam is the final dispensation for humanity as revealed to Muhammad and the necessity of restoring to it its true essence and pristine form, which had been lost through the centuries. Thus, Ahmadis view themselves as leading the revival and peaceful propagation of Islam. The Ahmadis were among the earliest Muslim communities to arrive in Britain and other Western countries.
Ahmadiyya adherents believe that God sent Ahmad, like Jesus, to end religious wars, condemn bloodshed and reinstitute morality, justice and peace. They believe that he divested Islam of fanatical beliefs and practices by championing what is in their view, Islam’s true and essential teachings as practised by the Prophet Muhammad. Ahmadi Muslims are divided into two subgroups; the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community and the Lahore Ahmadiyya Movement.
Mirza Ghulam Ahmad founded the movement on 23 March 1889 and termed it the Ahmadiyya Muslim Jama’at (community), envisioning it to be a revitalisation of Islam. Ahmadis consider themselves Muslims and claim to practice Islam in its pristine form; however, some Ahmadiyya-specific beliefs have been thought of as opposed to contemporary mainstream Islamic thought since the movement’s birth, and some Ahmadis have subsequently faced persecution.
More information: Chritistian-Muslim Marriage, Sharia, Koran, Bible, Marriage & Divorce laws.
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Do not make permanent decisions based on temporary feelings.
Was a Christian lady for over 5years, our love was too deep and when it was getting closer to realistic marriage, I took her to my still together Christian mum and Muslim dad.
She promised to change but I realised it was just a mouthsay.
Think of your children, I suffered real Islamic upbringing.
Fortunately, my other 3 brothers are also Muslims, but my elder and last not really serious.
I am an Ahmadi Muslim and from my level of exposure in the Ahmadiyya. I have come to understand that it doesn’t work, at least for the children if it does do the parents like mine.
Moreover. it did xox my dad isn’t that religious but just very okay with Islam.
My sis, come off it.
I loved Alice best all my life but she left at a very little challenge of her parents.
Be a happy Ahmadi.
Understand its coz of your future or at least your children.
I don’t know the outcome of Tanya but I do hope she has found a solution. I am an ex Ahmadi myself and converted to Christianity in 2013. I am a mature lady and was already married with two grown up children. Ahmadis appear very loving from the outside but believe me, they do have their flaws and do not practice Love for all, hatred for none. I was divorced, my family showed me hate to the point of fear of my life. It is a disillusion that they are tolerant even though they themselves are persecuted. Masroor is not a spiritual person let alone claiming to be a Khalifa of the true Islam.
To Tanya, I hope you continued with your studies and do find the right person to marry regardless of his religious background.
Reply at https://www.interfaithshaadi.org/?p=11242
Dear tanya,
I haven’t words to say you but I want to help you I don’t know how i help you but even if help you
.I am too armadillo girl and a familiar!
Should Tanya marry to the Christian?
Hi,
Can someone tell me how are marriages fixed in Ahmadiyya community in Pakistan? Is it arranged through a well-wisher? Do they also use matrimonial sites, if so, please provide few examples.
Thank you.
Dear ALL,
I am so glad to find this interesting discussion. I myself am really interested in Pashtun culture and Ahmadiyya sect.
I would like to know what are some different matrimonial services used by Pathans in KPK for marriages? How much do they rely on them? Are most of the marriages arranged by ‘well-wishers’?
Let us know what is your situation and we may be able to help you.
Dear Admin,
I am not in a situation per se, I am just really really impressed by Ahmadi sect.
To this day, I have never come across a religion which is Islamic but also combine other religions within it e.g. acknowledging Jesus, Krishna. I watch a lot of videos on how their leaders want the followers to practice this religion “Love for all, hate for none”. Of course, nothing is 100% perfect. I am sure there will be people belonging to the Ahmadiyya community, who could point out the problems they face.
Nevertheless, in addition to this, I am fascinated by Pashtun culture. Just like most of the cultures we have, Pashtuns seem to be really nice people. They seem simple and grounded. I have now started to learn the language myself (its difficult but I am trying).
I do not classify myself with any religion.I am not an atheist, I just haven’t found ONE religion that resonates with me, that’s why I take the best from what is presented in front of me. As I grew, I have realized that in countries like ours, culture and religion are so inter-twined, its hard to tell one from the other e.g. women in smaller towns are suggested to wear traditional clothes (not jeans etc) in order to be safe. These women could be Muslim, Hindu, Sikh. We can’t fight against the cheap mentality of the general public who blame a woman by the way she dresses up. I must not digress, but I hope you got my point.
Your reply and/or help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Akira.
Reply at https://www.interfaithshaadi.org/?p=11137
tanya contact me ok
03318366XXX (deleted by admin for your protection)
Are you Ahmadi? Give us details and we could help you.
hi
Instead of finding any solution. you guys are just making statements. If you have any proposal for her from ahmadiya community why dont you just help her
Zia, a good point. Wish people are objective to the youths in love. Can you try and share your views? It will help.
Asala Mu Aliequm
First of all, why shuold that very girl first declare herslef as an Ahmadi Muslim? For me she is not. Becoz Ahmadi is one who follows Prophet Muhammad (saw) and Promised Messiah (as). There is right for evry women in Islam to choose husband of her choice. But when she is in Islam that means boy must be a muslim and for ahmadi girl, must be ahmadi boy. One who loves God, also loves his prophets and their tecahings. Is any body here knows better than Almighty Allah and his Prophets? Religion has not created disorder in this world. It is we people are reponsible. We should all respect our religions and parents. Is anybody here the owner of this world, universe? Almighty Allah send his prophets with respected time and need. LIke we students join first primary then secondary classes. Jesus (as) Says after me, there will come another prophet with all truth (Gospel). what does it mean. Islam is the last religion and prophet Muhammad (saw) is his last prophet. So as a muslim when we are marrying other community persons, we are not followings our prophets and Almighty Allah as well. It is just becoz we are not in religion and have no any love to our prophets.
Rameez,
There is a conflict in your statement, “There is right for evry women in Islam to choose husband of her choice” and “in Islam that means boy must be a muslim”. There are (by Allah’s wishes) 5.6 Billion non-Muslims on this earth, why she must pick a Muslim? If yes, then you change your original statement that women don’t have a choice.
Next you said, Allah and his apostleS. Does it mean is it okay to skip Muhammad and follow Moses or the Son of God Jesus? Why the last is every thing? Why not the most popular apostle, Jesus (2.1 Billion followers)? Why not follow and give important to only the first Abraham?
admin,
just like you said “There are (by Allah’s wishes) 5.6 Billion non-Muslims on this earth, why she must pick a Muslim?” so it is allah`s wish that she must marry a muslim just like by allah`s wish there are billions of non-muslims.
Secondly you said “Next you said, Allah and his apostleS. Does it mean is it okay to skip Muhammad and follow Moses or the Son of God Jesus? Why the last is every thing? Why not the most popular apostle, Jesus (2.1 Billion followers)? Why not follow and give important to only the first Abraham?” — ya you can but as i said in islam every prophet is equal so we cannot skip any one of them, here i said it , also there are not 2.1billion jesus followers, majority of them say jesus is god, also jesus said to follow mohammad, same way abraham said his son ishmael descendants will have prohpets which is mohammad.
We like this “islam every prophet is equal”, so give each one in turns, not only Muhammad. Don’t link only Muhammad for the Shahadah, is that okay?
We know we are wasting your time. We know for Islam, Muhammad is every thing and we don’t have problem with it. Enjoy Muhammad and his teachings, however it does not work for the rest Allah’s 5.6 Billion creations.
There is nothing conflict in my statement. You just tell me one thing one who submits God Almighty never go against his teachings. It is not only Islam which is of this particular view to marry with ur faith members. From prophet Adam (as) to prophet Muhammad (saw), Allah Almighty deliver his best message to the people so that we may not suffer.There are more christian than muslims in this world becoz people luv more freedom and what is freedom u know better. I am not against religion but yeah who is righteous?
Religion is good when we understand it well and obey it. Christianity stands on TRINITY and still there are thousands of christians who believe that Jesus must have died long before. So my point is that one who claim religious should then follow his religion and one who does not then you can suggest him/her very well.
One more thing can u show me from any religious book except Quran that prophet came for all mankind. It is only Quran thatspeaks about prophet Muhammad (saw) as a messenger for whole mankind/whole world.
Marriage is not for loving each other and have sexual relation. There is wisdom behind that and every prophet marry women from his faith/religion becoz Allah Almighty wants people not to suffer and followc truth. One who submits to God never take marriage as easily we take.
Marriage is not for loving each other and have sexual relation. There is wisdom behind that and every prophet marry women from his faith/religion becoz Allah Almighty wants people not to suffer and follow truth. One who submits to God never take marriage as easily we take.
I would like marriage with ahamyyadia gir ,I am alone myself living in Melbourne
my name is JAHANGIR MUHAMMAD , single living in city Melbourne ,Australia , working engineer of Australia ,I belong from Lahore, was Instructor in the University of Engineering & Technology Lahore,I was lived in London last year come Melbourne,if you like really build your family & like my profile I can come to you any time only for marriage with you start new life any where, follow to partner interest, I am non smoker,non drinker & no have any bad habits if you like my profile , send contact my email, jahangirmian1@yahoo.com
Skype I’d. JAHANGIR10
Cell no +61470509993
Dear Tanya,
Just came across this discussion by chance. I am a Muslim married to an Ahmadi born girl. I had to get a Nikah done by their Murabi and then by our own Maulana afterwards. Initially her family thought they had converted me but now after 18 years together it has finally dawned on them that I am very much a mainstream muslim. Lot of them have now done a social boycott. Living abroad has helped but has put a lot of stress on her. My wife has now started to see through some of the cult controlling practices. I don’t rub it in and leave it as such.
The advice I can offer is for you to take your time. Don’t rush into anything. If you had a relationship with this fellow its not the end of the world. Many people go through same. No one displays these sheets in our culture (thats more of an Arab thing)
If he loves you too he should be able to pitch in and offer the same. Right now you are making all the compromises.
I don’t consider Ahmadiyya the true path but they do have a hold on your parents and they will get blackmailed if you go through with your plans. This is how Masroor rules over the rest!
If you both are adamant, go abroad and have a civil marriage. Give yourself time. Time is on your side.
Reply at https://www.interfaithshaadi.org/?p=7420
If her parents put stress & pressure on both if you, it is not the fault of the Religion or sect, islam & ahmadiyya is clear about marriage to people of the books, that is jews and christians.
Parents should not get involved in marital affairs. Blame her parents , not Ahmadiyya community.
All you need to know is on the website. http://Www.alislam.org
dear i am a muslim and a pray for u i think christans are more beter than ahmadiyya may God bless you and tell you the right way of Hadyat ameen
Tanya,
Revelation in New Testament foretells a time when a trumpet will sound and the dead in Christ shall rise first as Jesus returns. Christians believe that Jesus is the only son of God and that faith in Jesus is the only way to achieve salvation and to enter heaven. Jesus said (John 14:6): “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the father except through me.”
Are you okay if your children will be taught in your husband’s church that all Muslims and Hindus will not be saved (will get hell fire) because they were not baptized? Read Gandhi.
Dear Admin,
Thank You for bringing that to my knowledge. I wanted to tell you that although it was difficult, I did have a talk with my boyfriend about baptism of our children and church wedding. He said that it is alright if our children are brought up in both faiths and he says “hey i’m not the holiest of people you know, just want them to be good human beings “. Also I personally think that there’s a good chance this marriage will work if it takes place, because I myself am more of a humanist then a muslim.
My plan is that after I graduate in Computer Science, I’ll tell my parents. They will be shocked and it will be scary, and they will say no, and they WILL consider it betrayal, but they will eventually get over the shock and they’ll know it is what it is.
The problem is the incoming rishtas (proposals) from ahmadi families and my parents willingness to put me on display for possible suitors. I find it hypocrisy on my part that I have a boyfriend and yet I am still unable to tell my parents about it and therefore have to play along when families come over to see me, as is the case with purely arranged marriages. Thank you for your time and advice.
Still you have not found the answer we are looking for from that Christian. If he is really a humanist, like you, he will not insist on the baptism.
Do two things:
1) Go tell him clearly that our children will NOT be baptized. At their age 21, they could be what ever they wish, but no baptism in childhood, agree? and
2) After that go tell his parents and priest that we (your boy friend and you) have agreed not to baptize our children till their age 21.
Let us know what you found out. Good luck.
For now, we do not trust that Christian family till you get us the answer we are looking for. Meantime, for rishtas, keep all your options open. Keep a high bar for the guy; he must be well educated and earning well and a decent person. If you do come across such guy, then pick between two guys. If not, you have already a back plan.
Sorry above sound like a business plan, but you need to be smart and look for what is good for you. Do not be blind in love, because the love last only 6 months into the married life. It is your compatibility with the selected spouse that will bring long lasting happiness in the married life. Keep in touch!
Dear Admin,
Thank you for taking out time to reply, even the fact that someone out there is taking time out to help me brings joy to my heart. I must tell you, that I myself am very broad-minded, but unfortunately my parents are the opposite, particularly mother. I have made up my mind that whoever I marry should be broadminded, and should be respectful towards women, and be respectful towards all religions of the world. I consider the displaying of bloody bedsheets a massive disrespect towards women. We have so much more to offer then a hymen.
That being said, the problem is that my mother had made it very clear to me that she will not attend my wedding or keep any relations with me if i choose to marry with my own choice, and father will die of shame. Life is becoming a living hell for me because my parents want me to live a conservative styled life, observe hijab, not go out with even my girl friends. So I have to lie continuously to meet my boyfriend, which i don’t like doing, but there’s no choice. Also the conflicts with my parents are increasing day by day.
The only happiness i get is when i escape to my christian boyfriends house and live the life of freedom, where i can wear what i want, eat or drink as whatever i want, dance to whatever song i want. But it kills me inside to know that my parents will never ever agree to this relationship .
How do you think i should tell my parents, and when. Since I am still a student, and im not earning anything, im scared to tell them right away. Please advice me.
Before we reply to your on how to handle your parents and problems with Ahmadis, first tell us about those Christians.
You feel freedom, dance, drinks, etc, but is it a different kind of nicely decorated prison or a golden trap? We are not sure if those Christians are any different than your Ahmadi. All those love and freedom you see in the Christian home will disappear as soon as they learn that you declined to have a wedding in a Church and declined to baptized your children. Explain us what baptism has to do with your love? If his love is a true LOVE, why he will not accept you without baptism? Why that 5 min dip in water is more critical for them than the love and joy you are willing to bring to that Christian guys life? Why their love for you is a conditional love (requirement for baptism). If baptism is a must for your children, then they are absolutely intolerant out to proselytize you, nothing more.
Unfortunately, we do NOT see any difference between your Ahmadi community and those Christians you are dealing with. First find out if those Christians are not “intolerant” and willing to accept you, a “Muslim”, in their life.
Please help us understand those Christians. Ask them you do not feel appropriate your children having baptism, instead we will teach children from both the Bible and Koran (pluralism).
Tanya,
Thank you for writing, “Thank you for taking out time to reply, even the fact that someone out there is taking time out to help me brings joy to my heart.” Read what others have to say for us here.
Note we are non-profit and have nothing to gain if you remain a Muslim or convert to Christianity. Only we wish you to make an “informed” decision for your life. Further, we are not here to make you happy in a short run, but wish to see you happy 15 years down in your married life.
To help you make an “informed” decision, let us know if those Christians are tolerant to who you are, a Muslim. Please find truth and let us know. We are waiting.
Dear Admin,
Thank You for your quick reply and suggestion. Regarding finding a suitable Ahmadi boy, let me tell you that we are a minority in Pakistan, and there are less is a very very tiny percentage , i’m not sure of the figure but its less then 1% of Ahmadi people in Pakistan. So its very difficult to find someone. Other then that we are restricted by community not to mingle around with boys as it is a conservative religion.So we are supposed to purely rely on arranged marriages through intermediate matrimonial services offered by the community. If I do find a relatively suitable match through these matrimonial services, I highly doubt the Ahmadi boy or family would accept a girl who isn’t Virgin, and since I will not be able to display any bloody bed sheets, I guess i’ll be better off not marrying these narrow-minded people.
Coming to the second part, my Christian boyfriend’s parents will not have any problems regarding our marriage and rather they are very supportive towards it. As far as the wedding is concerned , we would have it in the church only, since NO Ahmadi cleric would perform my nikaah with a non-ahmadi. As far as the children are concerned, our plan is to let them adopt their fathers (Christian) religion, and meanwhile educate them about their mothers religion as well, so that they become tolerant and respectful towards all religions. As far as names are concerned, i really don’t think that it matters what a persons name is as long as the person is brought up to respect all religions and be a virtuous and know morals.
Lastly, my boyfriends age being younger to mine is the least of my concerns. But what worries me is that it is very very wrong to breakup with someone you love because his beliefs are different from yours. Secondly, if i dont break up, then where is this leading me, because my parents have made it very clear that they will disown me if I decide to marry with my own will.
Please help me out of this mental anguish !!
Dear Tanya,
Thank you for getting back. We have a lot to say so please keep in touch with us over years.
First, if you are not virgin, that changes the whole picture. For you, now only your option left is to marry someone who does not believe in displaying bloody bed sheet. Further, we would like to tell you that you do not have to feel obligation to marry the guy you had sex with (if he is not fully compatible with you or if he is not willing to accept you the way you are, meaning a “Muslim”).
We feel a religious proselytizer Christian has trapped you. Those Christians do not love you; they love to convert you from Islam to Christianity and nothing more. The day you will say you will not accept baptism for your children, this guy will run away from you. Try it.
Why are you so submissive? Why you want a wedding in a Church, have children Baptized and give them Christian names? So, you are ending your Muslim heritage and starting a Christian heritage? This is not an IM-WE (Interfaith Marriage With Equality). We highly recommend keeping an option open to raise children in BOTH faiths (meaning no Baptism). Better would be to let the children decide their own faith at their age 21.
You may be tired of your Ahmadi practices and thus found Christianity impressive. You are jumping from a frying pan to fire! Do you realize that these intolerant Christians are no different than your Ahmadi people? The Christian church will not perform your wedding unless you give them in writing that your children will be Baptized and raised in Christian faith only. Those Christian families who loves you now will immediately become your number one enemy as soon as they find out that you do not agree to Baptized your children and ready to give up your Islamic faith. After marriage, your marriage life will be dictated by the Pope (not Jesus) sitting some place in Italy, is that what you want? Further, after marriage they will not appreciate you performing namaz in their Christian home. Why do you not want to keep options open in case if you wish to be a true Muslim?
Remember, there is a big difference between Jesus’ messages and what these churches want you to do (read Follow Jesus, not church). We wish you be proud of your birth religion and plan to live your married life with equality of two faiths (meaning no baptism to please the church).
If you remain a pure Muslim and let your children half Muslim, it is possible some day your parents will get over and start loving you. However, if you decide to raise Christian children that will certainly be painful to your parents till they die.
There is nothing you have to gain by baptizing your children. Just say NO BBS to him, make sense? -Admin
Assalam alikom,
All my greetings to you Admin and Tanya and I really hope that I’m not too late and I would be thankfull if I could get a reply back from both of you for confirmation. I would like to share my point of view and I hope it’s not too late. I’m a Sunni Muslim boy and I was in a relationship with a very religious Mormon girl (Mormonism is a sect of Christianity that’s parallel to Ahmadiyya in Islam). So I find that our situation is a bit reversed since you love a guy from the major Christian sect while she loved a guy from the major Muslim sect. I’m sincerely going to tell you about my experience. Both of us were religious and therefore we stayed good in term of avoiding premarital sex which was a hard obstacle for me. We were there for three long years and let me tell you, despite She was a nice girl and from a nice family by all means things were not going to work out between us. None of us wanted to convert to the other’s religion which was fine for me. Needless to say, we still had our own conflicts in term of how will we raise our children and how will we live. There was a strong emotional connection but I swear that such thing wears off with time and then you will end up with the differences and conflicts you ignored. It wasn’t going to work at all. I’m glad it’s over now for over two years and I thank Allah it didn’t go ahead. Trust me if you are both religious, things will never go well between the two of you. If you really believe in your religion, how can you justify yourself to marry a non-Ahmadi? Things might seem fine at first but once there is a kid or even before, problems might start,the only way for this thing to workout is if one of you doesn’t care completely. I agree with the admin that you seem very submissive and this is the desperation and blindness of love. I hope you don’t get insulted or offended but please find your way through the mind because the heart is misguiding. I lived such good joyful romantic moments but it only made it harder to finish it later. The sooner you realise, the less loss you will have. I know the admin here is a Hindu and opposes what I might say but you know for us and other Abrahamic faiths that marriage is a licence from God. If you believe that God doesn’t approve of it then it’s pointless. Accept this from me as a brother who went through the same road and turned back before it was too late.
Reply at https://www.interfaithshaadi.org/?p=8888
Dear Tanya,
I have my friends from ahmedi community & they were extreme loving, i know them. I am pakistani & doing Phd in Poland,christian, & looking some ahmedi to marry with me but cool one. If you have got any link do tell me. I wont ask her to be christian but we have to kow to live happily with both religions.
Do Tell me as soon as possible.
Regards
Daud
Hello daud,
There is a mission house in warsaw, you could get in touch with them.